Ratio of VC/C & VB

I've only been programming for 2.5 years, and never taken a single course in programming. I'm self taught.

It's just whatever I do, I put effort into learning. I don't program for a living, but could if I wanted to. In fact, I'm saving for college over the next 2 years so I can get a degree and be a meterologist/computer scientist.

But, as you said Xeon - you don't have to worry about that stuff in VB, you do in C++. But I don't worry about it, because 99% of the time, any bug I have produced has been a simple typo. (and == instead of an =, etc...) I just simply feel that limiting capability - and trying to 'protect' a programmer from mistakes, instead of trying to teach them how to be a better programmer, is the wrong course of action. Stick with the VB's, C#'s, and all the 'protective' languages and you'll be stuck there. I just feel it's people like me that work with C/C++/Assembly that will be the future OS writers/etc... And that is why I say Microsoft will fall to Linux eventually. (Not because of open source, but because of the way they are grooming their future clients) - Fact of the matter is, people don't like upgrading hardware. And MS has already written much of the .NET OS in C#, which runs at 60% the speed of C++. If this continues, a Windows OS will need a much faster CPU (and more RAM) to compete with other OS'es. Plus cover ups in bugs seems to always be another layer added on top to hide the bug, instead of fixing it directly. It multiplies by trying to create a user base highly dependent on the protective languages. Plus, we've already seen that the internet age will never replace the importance of the desktop (although for years people said it would. Even that Java would be the killer of C++ because of it, but we all see and know Java is not the be all or end all - and it's not as big as it once was - just look around the net) But, since this is going off topic, I'll leave it right there.

Oh I see! Nice information and nice debates, James!

Anyway, I really hope Microsoft could come to their senses and stop going around with this .net and XML thingy.

I was wondering : if they had continue with the old ways of Windows programming and had put all their energy into upgrading the Win32 API to Win64 instead of .net, the world would be a much better plavce to program in! :)

Quote:

---

But I don't worry about it, because 99% of the time, any bug I have produced has been a simple typo. (and == instead of an =, etc...)

---

From what u said, u must be a talented programmer. :D
For my case, 99.9% of those serious and tough-to-find bugs are related to heaps and memory management issues. :)
That's why!

Anyway, I guess Microsoft is trading speed with program interopability.(C++, Java, C# and VB programs can all talk with one another as if they're best friends and such)

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Xeon
Anyway, I guess Microsoft is trading speed with program interopability.(C++, Java, C# and VB programs can all talk with one another as if they're best friends and such)

---

I also feel that's what's happening. After all, what's a few seconds delay in comparison with the flexibility that interoperability offers.

Ah well, AIO.......but the thing is that as time goes by and the world code programs according to these darn and low standards, performance will be worse and worse over time. In fact, the more interopable programs become, the slower the speed.(it seems)
COM components can be slow, mind you.(just an example)

After all, the fact that a C++ program can talk to a VB program defies the law of the programming languages world : it's not natural at all, and if it's even possible, then really artificial coding techniques and dirty coder must have been used in order for that to happen.

Pals, let's all give up Windows and pick up a book on "C++ for Linux". :):D

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Xeon


U had better not let the VB programmers here remember your name! For all u know, your boss might force you to code something in VB one day, and while u're all panicky and such, u thought that u might be able to get help from the VB forum at Codeguru. But because of your statement, they get angry and refused to help you, and you can only go elsewhere.......and if word gets around that u made this statement, all the VB programmers in this world would boycott you and you can only get prepared to explain to your boss why u didn't finished your VB program!

---

Yep, James, I'll remember you :D

Heh heh heh!
Yes, yes........put his name down onto your bed and recite his name 20 times per hour.
Tell all your VB pals all about him and tell them to pass on the news. Set up web sites and forums to discuss about him. Get talented guys to write a book to tell the planet about him.
To ensure total boycotting, create mugs, t-shirts and mouse-pads that encourages boycotting of James.
Get the US government to fund you so that u can set up statelites all over space to track his actions, so that we know when he registers under another user to ask a VB question.
:)

But the way, Platinum Plus.....it seems that 100% of your posts are all crap, eh? Whoa! Xeon Version 2.0, code-named Platinum Plus???!!! :D:D:D:D

Quote:

---

Originally posted by JamesSchumacher
Stick with the VB's, C#'s, and all the 'protective' languages and you'll be stuck there. I just feel it's people like me that work with C/C++/Assembly that will be the future OS writers/etc... And that is why I say Microsoft will fall to Linux eventually.

---

Assy, ML, C, C++, Fortran and I think the one who is quick to the solutions wins the day.

Yeah, Platinum Plus is right.
U gotta use the right tools for the right job, just like the way u get the right **** to give you the right excitment at the right ambience and time and place, right? :)

It's all about using the RIGHT stuff. :):D:D

Quote:

---

But the way, Platinum Plus.....it seems that 100% of your posts are all crap, eh? Whoa! Xeon Version 2.0, code-named Platinum Plus???!!! :D:D:D:D

---

Maybe crap but not offensive :cool:

By the way:

1. In VC++, what will happen if there is no MFC?
2. Everytime you need a button, you have to call API (if no MFC)?
3. Can non-Microsoft (non-Visual) C++ use MFC?

From Platinum :

Quote:

---

Maybe crap but not offensive

---

And MY posts ARE NOT offensive either! :p:p:p:D:)

From AIO :

Quote:

---

1. In VC++, what will happen if there is no MFC?
2. Everytime you need a button, you have to call API (if no MFC)?
3. Can non-Microsoft (non-Visual) C++ use MFC?

---

Interesting questions, AIO! I salute ye'!

1) In Visual C++(the Tool of all Tools), if you wanna create a Windows program and there's no MFC, u're dead. U can give up your job as a programmer and sell jellies or gurls(or both) instead. Kinda sad.....but.....

Nah! Just kidding! Well, in Visual C++.....if there's no MFC, you'll have to work with the Win32 API directly.
But in my opinion, there's really not much of a syntax difference or anything, cos' MFC is just a thin "wrapper" around the Win32 API.
The name of most of the GUI functions are even the same, as well as the type of parameters etc.

2) Everytime u need a control(buttons, like you say) in Visual C++ without MFC, u need to call the Win32 API Create(...) or CreateEx(...) function and specify the type of control u wanna create.(from combo boxes to push-buttons).
But in Visual C++, it's very very very very very natural to call Win32 API functions, unlike in VB.

In Visual C++, u just call the function directly, without the need to explicitly add those Declare Private Sub NameOfAPI_Function(.........................................) stuff for each API function you use.
At the most, u just code something like #include <xxx.h> etc and u'll be able to use all functions belonging to that catergory or class. :D

3) No........from what I know, non-Visual C++ IDEs cannot use MFC. MFC comes only with Visual C++, and even if you try to copy the MFC files for use with a non-Visual C++ compiler, it wouldn't work, cos' there's -1000000000000% support for MFC in most of them.
Borland C++, however, has it's own set of class library equivalent to MFC, called the OWL.(Object Windows Library)

:D:)

Quote:

---

Originally posted by aio


I also feel that's what's happening. After all, what's a few seconds delay in comparison with the flexibility that interoperability offers.

---

Uhh. What's a few seconds in delay you ask. It means the world if your writing device drivers specifically FileSystem filter hook drivers that communicate with VC++ apps via LPC.

Also real-time or near real-time data display. But there are tons of situations where you need speed. And while using ASM to get you around that, who wants to write line after line after line of ASM until you lose your sight when MickeySoft should leave well enough alone.

Hi there Mick! Well, anyway, regarding ASM(Assembly Language), do u know anything about it?
It's very mysterious to me. Is there any branch/flow statements like in C++?(if...else...else if...) and is there even any thing like functions?

If not, wouldn't it be impossible to work with???? God!!!!
I can't imagine anyone trying to use pure ASM to create a simple button control!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek::eek: :eek::eek: :eek:

There are functions and flow control statements in assembler, they are actually quite powerful. I mean, everything that you write in C++ is compiled into ASM anyways (maybe directly machine-code, but that's "equivalent" to ASM), so everything you can do with C++, you can also do it with ASM.

Creating a button control in ASM would be a waste though. But coding the slow parts of your program in optimized ASM will always remain useful, even in 2010 ;)

Oh I see! Thanks a lot, Yves!
By the way, it seems that you've just become the "superset" version of Simon666. U're Yves777. Why?
Cos' your total posts are at 777!!!!!!!
Whoa! Nice number! :):D

Anyway, from what I know, coding in ASM is already total ****. If you go down any further from ASM, u'll meet the Abyss : Machine Language. I've heard that in the past, coders code in Machine Language directly!!!!!!!
Just plain numbers, which is 1000 times worse than ASM!

Can u beat that??!!!

Here's 1 test u can do to see if which programmer is actually God Himself :

Ask him to code Microsoft Office XP entirely in Machine Language. :D