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Sometimes, I have the strange feeling that somebody is asking a question in order to create a virus, or to send lots of mails, to records keys entered by a user, to bypass security features, etc.
Do you have the same doubts?
Do you think we should give an answer to every question?
Wrong answers is bad style. No doubts will you answer or not new spam bombers and viruses will be created. So relax
Hmm.. I ignore some, But most of the time I reply stating that these types of 'Solutions' lead to BAD Things, and although i know how to or where to, It will not be posted on the open forum...
There after I ignore them .....
Gremmy....
This information isn`t secrete you may get on open foruns too :DQuote:
Originally Posted by GremlinSA
I could tell you *SECRETS*, but if I did, I'd have to KILL YA! :)
I would actually ask for more details and the reason why this is being asked. If I still have doubt, I would ask them to PM me with the specific reasoning.
And once I find out that the intention is bad, I would directly say that we do not discuss this here as per our AUP.
Try to figure out the actual purpose of the question. If you think it's about creating malicious software, ignore the question, rather than giving (deliberately) a wrong answer. That is unethical in my opinion.
Yes that`s right answer :thumb: :DQuote:
Originally Posted by dglienna
Sometimes, there is a thin line between right and wrong. If it's quite obvious that the question is indeed about something malicious, well, ignore it. If at first, it doesn't seem so / or your'e in 2 minds about the post, rather try to ask more details about the original question.
I would ask for more info. I don't want to scare someone away just for asking something with curiosity and interest. Moreso, sometimes people don't use english as native language, so it becomes even more important to understand what is being asked.
If you question it, don't ignore it. Report it to someone that might understand better.
I don't know or do such programming work that I could help them... :(
But does anyone share this view with me - if you giving out an answer - you are probably educating an ill-intentioned user but at the same time you are educating a lot many other people who can be aware.
It is like when someone asks how AIDS spreads - you just don't tell them because they will start/help spreading AIDS. It is good to tell them how it spreads so that people on the whole can be aware and benefit. In general, programming can not be more important than life. What do others have to say on this? Might be interesting to get different views.
I have seen questions that were shot down because people said they can be used for malicious purposes, etc. Very often I get the impression that people who shoot the OP down on grounds of dubious intention are -Very often such questions posed do not have a feasible solution, and members who answer are not conveying this information in black and white - probably because they themselves are not sure.
- Not answering the question asked.
- Not able to solve the problem posed regardless of intent.
- Not willing to accept point #2.
- Not being of any help to the person asking and to those reading.
Honestly, I don't think making a virus is as easy as get-set-go. Ditto for questions that tend to incline towards hacking into passwords and keys.
Last but not the least, forums like CG are *not* anonymous enough for any person with malicious intent to get his problems solved. I also think that most programmers out here don't have the kind of experience it needs to programme a malicious bit of software (of course, I don't mean that they don't have experience, just that it is not in the domain of malicious programming).
olivthill, I couldn't vote because none fits my response. :)
Sid, what you say is completely agreeable to me. Personally, I think, that providing those solutions or atleast providing a guidance is not so dangerous as to not provide it. Even without CG helping those people there are so many viruses/worms etc out there. There are even dedicated programming sites and general websites out there.
Moreover, I don't think that anyone here on CG provides a complete solution to any problem. People usually are happy to get answers to the things that they are stuck with, some suggestions, ways to make better etc etc. But no one seeks or gets "complete" solution/program. They are termed "homework" questions. And rightly so. Since, one is not giving a full blown application, I don't think discussing how malware/spyware/viruses work or are implemented is really bad and shouldn't be done. If one thinks that the information they are providing can be used dangerously, why not suggests ways to tackle those as well so that others can benefit from the why and how as well as resolutions.
To conclude, I think partial solutions or answers can be provided to a level that they "can" be helpful in reaching a solutions if OP grasps it. May be explain further if really not clear to OP but not give a full-blown application or code that can be used as-is. Actual decision making depends on the actual case at hand.
Another analogy (there are many) - if commiting murder is illegal/against law it does not mean people cannot discuss how murders happen. Or would you say, I would not discuss about how murders take place because the person will start doing so. Well, if you ask me, who knows why can't you yourself, possessing the knowledge, start doing it?
The art of shooting a gun is taught and is legal - using it to kill someone is illegal. Similarly, parting knowledge is okay and the onus is on the person possessing the knowledge to not use it deliberately in an unsafe way to harm others.
Too many people aren't writing viruses. They are just annoying their friends, and sometimes it gets out of hand. I guess that's how they got started.
Somone builds a 'Folder Flooder' and posts it to 'help' others.
Bad idea, and it got him in the end. A couple of years later, he accidentally clicked on the exe, resulting in thousands of new folders with hidden files, etc.
At least he knew how to remove it. I don't help people usually that want to rename everything or copy everything. Too easy to modify.
I also didn't vote.
Really? All these processes are very *standard* installation and deployment use-cases.Quote:
Originally Posted by dglienna
I see no point in denying help to someone on these grounds - save for cases when one doesn't know the topic well enough to contribute.
And? What's the problem with that?Quote:
Originally Posted by dglienna
Anyone who has the expertise in writing trojan horses and viruses would be the last one in need of help towards renaming files or deleting them - these wont present any hurdle to such a person.
If it sounds like it may be used for malicious purposes, I usually choose to ignore the question.
I myself have created a worm using C# but its an extremely simple worm that anyone with a moderate understanding of programming C# (or C++) could do. I wont explain how I did it due to its nature and I dont want someone unleashing it on someone else but its pretty easy. I mostly just wanted to see if it could be done.
Point being, if someone wants to create a virus, theyll eventually figure out how, or give up. Either way I wouldnt even humor them with an answer.
Well, I've only seen one actual post where someone wanted to delete all the files on his friends computer 'as a joke'. He caught some grief.
I assume most people wouldn't be that obvious.
If it's not logical, (even with an explanation), then I won't help.
Joining what exterminator said, the knowledge about worms, trojan and spyware function is very useful to protect yourself against them.
Really, non-programmer people tend to have no clue at security risks, and don't see where the "holes" are. Consequently, they're first choice victims of trojans (they execute everything) and worms (they use an admin account for everything, and don't see where processes boundaries are, and where scripts are executed).
As exterminator said, knowing how AIDS spread is rarely used to spread it. It's used to prevent its spread.
Most worms and trojans are written by professional people, to spread rootkits or spywares.
Those people don't ask questions on codeguru (I think).
The time where young people who wanted to "break the system", without financial benefit, were writing a virus, is ended. Or, at least, they form less than a few percents of malwares.
Isnt it possible to fill a harddrive using a worm? That was the whole idea behind mine, I wanted to see what would happen and how it would happen and I was rather spooked by the results of my own creation.
I did the calculations and found that every second it was filling up roughly 65 MB of harddrive space. That means it could easily fill my 80 GB drive in about 21 minutes >.<