im sorry for not being pecific but i wasnt talking about template specialization i was talking about defining variables... Tho its been a along time since i used "typename<> variable".
Sorry again for not being pecific. Im not sure if its any diffrent now from the last time that i used VC++ with default template parameters

And your right there is a work around but its really annoying using ::T bit, and i get tangled in giving the classes the name i wanted to give.