Learning English

[ThachQuanVy]

How long does it take one to learn English so he can use it as a native speaker ? Writing, speaking anything random, fast, of course without any grammar mistakes ? I have met people who are not native with long years of stay in the US but why they still make English mistakes ? They don't use the English language in the US ?

[Skizmo]

How long does it take one to learn English so he can use it as a native speaker ?

Practice, practice and more practice. It all depends on how much you practice and on how good you can learn.

I have met people who are not native with long years of stay in the US but why they still make English mistakes ?

I even make errors in my own native language... I think that error-free is a big goal to reach. That's why they invented spell-check

[Eri523]

How long does it take one to learn English so he can use it as a native speaker ?

Strictly speaking, one who didn't grow up with the language in question can't ever become a native speaker, regardless of how good he/she will ever master the language. That's by definition.

Aside from that, I can only second what Skizmo posted.

[nuzzle]

How long does it take one to learn English so he can use it as a native speaker ? Writing, speaking anything random, fast, of course without any grammar mistakes ? I have met people who are not native with long years of stay in the US but why they still make English mistakes ? They don't use the English language in the US ?

To become a native speaker you must become fully immersed in the language before the age of 10 (with individual variation of course). I've noticed this with people who were not born in my country. If they arrived before 10 there is no trace whatsoever of an accent or grammatical mistakes. If they arrived later you can always tell.

If you missed the 10 years window of opportunity it is possible to come close to native fluency through practice. But only close, never complete. I guess it is because no amount of training can rewire the linguistic network of the brain once it has been established. After that you can only add at the margin, not change the structure.

[laserlight]

If they arrived before 10 there is no trace whatsoever of an accent or grammatical mistakes.

I think Skizmo has a point in that native speakers are not immune to grammatical mistakes, so no trace of such errors is not necessarily a hallmark of a native speaker. I suspect that even if a native speaker What I think is the hallmark of a native speaker is the use of certain idioms and patterns of speech that can be recognised by another native speaker, but which would be unlikely to be used unconsciously by a non-native speaker, even one whose command of grammar is better than most of the native speakers of the language. Consequently, it might not be that a native speaker does not have an accent, but that the accent is consistent with native speakers of the language.

[nuzzle]

I think Skizmo has a point in that native speakers are not immune to grammatical mistakes, so no trace of such errors is not necessarily a hallmark of a native speaker.

Well, maybe the word "broken" better conveys my meaning. If you don't become fully immersed in a language before the age of about 10 your speech will always sound broken (even so slightly) in the ears of a native speaker. I'm no linguist or neurobiologist so I can't explain the nature of "broken" but everybody should know what I mean.

Now my point is that in my experience, after this age related window of opportunity has closed you can never reach native command of a language regardless of how much you practice. It will always be a second language to you. But you can get close so practice is by no means wasted. Especially in structured settings. Look at singers and actors.

And in reply to the OP. I think the reason is complacency. Non-native speakers simply stop trying when they've reached a working level of fluency in the new language which allows them to function comfortably in everyday life.

[Arjay]

Learning English is relatively easy if you get the right book.

I recommend, "Learning English in 21 Days".

[Skizmo]

Is that from the same author as "Learn to code in 21 days" ?

[Arjay]

Is that from the same author as "Learn to code in 21 days" ?

Yep

[Arleen]

English learning is too much easy with helping book and dictionary...
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